IN NEED OF A MINESWEEPER

umm... put 2-3 scouts in the mined system, and watch them do their thing?

never tried that, most of the time im trying to get them out the system and back to gathering intel...while my fleet does its work of clearing out the gravity well.....i guess ill just have to try it and see

Yep, use the scouts.  Sometimes they'll still get blown away if they aren't being extremely careful, but they're inexpensive & quick to replace.  I personally use 4 or 5 when there's a very large bunch of mines, and they make very short work of them.

or you could create a mod with a flak frigate receiving a mine detect ability and jump them in first and let them do their thing.

harpo

Yay mods!

.... mines would be SO FRICKEN WORTHLESS if flak frigates could reveal them.

scouts fleeted with flak will wipe clean any minefield, no need for a dedicated minesweeper

personally i only thought scouts detected mines didnt know they took care of them. But I still think their needs to be some kindof dedicated minesweeper as theirs a dedicated anti-structure cruiser. So its not too far fetched or useless. As itll be a defined counter to mines.

Basically what I just said.  Having a dedicated minesweeper would be just plain overkill. 

As has already been said, scouts "reveal" mines so all your other units can attack them.  Flaks kill mines viciously quickly.  Scouts + flaks = dead mines.  Not only is there no need for a miracle unit when this combo does the job so well, it would be overkill and push mines into absolute uselessness.

yet bombers are sooo good at anti structure, and still the devs added a dedicated anti structure unit...........i dont care how strong a starbase can get. Ive wiped them out with just a few passes with large numbers of bombers and fighters. So to say theres no need, when the devs have done it before. Point is even in real life while their are a number of counters to things, Militaries still use dedicated units to overkill something.......cause its better to overkill then underkill anything.

true in real life, to overkill things is better then to underkill

video games on the other hand are more designed for fun and enjoyment so to overkill things is actually not a good idea

also if you compare the rate at which bombers cost (cost of carriers) vs the cost of dedicated anti-structure vessels, the anti-structure vessels win out were as the flak and scout (i usually do about 3 scouts with 20 flak) combo is already cheap and to get the same effect would not be very cost effective unless you made the vessel very cheap or very powerful both of which have problems of their own

ive never had a use for antistructure vessels because im quiet reliant on bombers/fighters because they do more then one thing for me. Targeting structures and vessels alike. But my point of view prior to knowing what flak and scouts could do together my concept was it was needed. Now its turning into well if the devs are gonna waste their time creating a vessel for the simple purpose of destroying only structures..........why not mines. Obviously the reasoning behind the antistructure was to combat the very overpowered starbases. With that said my point is if their gonna do it for structures. then its not overkill if they have a weapon for mines.

This isn't even comparable. To counter a starbase, you need at least 10 squads of bombers, more like 20 if you want to do it quickly.  If it's got backup, you may need upwards of 50 squads to get the job done reliably.  If mines aren't protected, a single scout and flak combo will actually clean it up quite quickly. 

In case A, 100 command of units can clear up any starbase, that's a little excessive (particularly early game) so a low-cost specialist alternative unit was created.

In case B, 6 command of units can clear up any minefield, there is no need for a low-cost alternative when such an efficient choice already exists.

thats not my point. my point is we dont even really need a antistructure vessel. Ive done it every game since buying entrenchment. The idea is. If the devs are gonna create something that really isnt needed because other alternatives can take care of it then theres no real big issue over creating another unit that concentrates on something in particular.

some, like you and me, like to build huge fleets and pound the enemy into submission with the biggest hammer we can find

others like to do quick hit and run raids that throw the enemy off balance before giving the killing blow

for ones like you and me, bombers are the most effective weapon of choice

for those that like hit and run the antistructure vessels are better

as for the mines you barely need anything and there is no need to suit a tactical need

Thank you.

If you aren't going to attack until you have a massive fleet, of course bombers are your best bet and you have no need for assault cruisers.  I often attack when I may only have five or six carriers, all of which devoted to fighters to counter LRF.  Assault cruisers are necessary to get the job done early game or with smaller and less decisive force.  That's not the case with mines; a scout and a flak frigate get the job done very reasonably early or late game.

just go above or below the mines

z-axis control for the win. Most people don't take the time to place their mines in a 3d manner.

For me (SP mind you) I've generally got a decent sized fleet by the time my opponent has started building minefields and possibly a starbase; so I'll jump my fleet in out of range of said starbase with autoattack switched off and at least four scouts.  Have your ogrovs/starfish attack the starbase from a distance moving your fleet out of harms way continually if matched up against vasari, micromanage your fleet to eliminate any active threats and then start working on the stationary threat (mines).  Do the prerequisite scouting to find out where the safe location is to enter the planets orbit if there is one otherwise, you're gonna take a beating reguardless.  Also any carriers, cap or cruiser, helps with their fast reaction times as the mines are revealed.

I've figured out how to place mines in 3d. Its doable, it just takes a bit of thinking, Kind of obvious though, the easiest way to do it is w/ the advent homing mines; just move your mine squad into posistion BEFORE you tell them to deploy. The way to do it with the tec and vas mines is very similar. Its not abuse, its just up to the player to take the time to do it. And most people don't and just say "it's impossible!" and give up.

same goes for StarBases. You normally dont see them early on mostly midgame. Unless your dealing with a Starbase rush. And thats what AntiStructure Cruisers were actually brought in to combat. Ive never had to use them. Even when a Starbase is thrown into a minor gravity well i control. With only 4 Bomber Squadrons and 4 Fighter Squadrons they still take down a Starbase with ease. Even a semi upgraded Starbase doesnt last long. The only one I havent gone up against is one with 20k hull, Mostly because I dont let them get that far. But my opinion is, for me the AntiStructure Cruisers are a nice option but in my case a waste of fleet supply On the other hand Id really like to see a MineSweeper Frigate as it would allow me to clear a path into the gravity well without having to Micro the movement of my ships around not just the enemy forces but their mines. the trick with flak is nice but flak need support to stay alive. That means bringing in HC's and LRFs which also need Hoshi's. Which comes back to my point. Jumping an entire fleet directly into a minefield is doing exactly what the enemy wants you to. Not every ship is going to avoid these things even if their able to see them. Most times theyll push through. My only counter is to push my fleet out to the farthest part of my gravity well and then jump them into the enemy gravity well where theyll drop out of phasespace in the outer ring gravity well of the enemy planet.

and the minesweepers would need even more support, because flak can handle SC, dedicated minesweepers could not handle anything else theoretically, and if they did they would be OP

No micro whatsoever is required. Build scout. Build flak frigate. Fleet scout and flak frigate. Jump to minefield. Sit back and watch the explosions. I suggest actually trying this before continuing to theorycraft in this thread.

So in other words, you want a single ship you can build that renders mines entirely useless?

their usesless after the fact i didnt say anything about the minesweeper being invincible. and as far as building flak and scouts just to counter their mines. sorry but i dont do the whole spam thing, it really doesnt fit my idea of a real strategy game. but you guys can continue arguing this, your not making as strong of a point as you think you are.

first of all we dont spam, one or two scouts with 5 to 10 flak is not spam

second you are not make even a point except that you want a new ship