Check the "TechAgeDefs.xml" in the \data\Game\ folder, you can set the number of techs required for each age there. But it doesn't mean anything in practice. Another way is to put all your planets in build mode and skip research for a few turns   Interstellar travel (and maybe Universal Translator) is usually all I get early on.

Yes, modifying "TechAgeDefs.xml" will indeed change the number of techs required to be eligible to unlock the next Age Technologies. I have modified this in my game to make the first age (Age of Expansion) last 20 Techs.

I think what Saruboy was trying to say was, it will not slow your research rate down, just mean you need more techs to unlock higher level ones.

I get that. I want to modify both the Age value and the Research required per tech.

Feel like I'm hitting my head against a brick wall but I have made a breakthrough I think. For the life of me I couldn't work out exactly (mathematically) how the multiplier and exponent were affecting tech rates. Then I realised that research values are adjusted by a hidden value based on map size. The only modifier based on map size I can find in the xml is the ship range one and it's not using that value... so right now I can't seem to pin down the exact formula but it's progress albeit slow.

Map size modifiers appear to be approximately:

Medium 0.77
Large 0.86
Huge 0.9
Gigantic 1.32

Obviously I'm missing something, so the formula isn't straightforward. I was hoping I could find some insight in the xml but since I haven't maybe someone else has?

Oh right, the Tech Age do matter. It blocks research if you aren't in it. I think a "Doh!" is in order...  Doh!

I am also unhappy with having to run the script every time I want a different research cost scenario. And copy paste TechDefs files all the time. But it's only until Stardock fixes things.

The formulas I found for tech cost were:

case A (normal):  Cost = 29 * e^(0.3715*tier)

case B (+10% cost): Cost = 1.1 * 29 * e^(0.3715*tier)

case C (-10% cost): Cost = 0.9 * 29 * e^(0.3715*tier)

tier = 0 to 9 (at least I think 9 is highest), normally how deep a tech is in a tree, but some have higher or lower values than one might expect

If the Cost has a decimal value it is always rounded down (so 60.9 becomes 60).

Most techs are of case A. For the weapons; Kinetics are case A (+0%), Beams are case B (+10%) and Missiles are case C (-10%). This seems to be offset by the cost of the support techs to each weapon.

If you wish to modify the tech cost, you can insert a modifier like this

Cost = 29 * e^(0.3715*tier*modifier)

And then to have the Cost be, say 10 times higher, for the tier 9 technologies, you can calculate what modifier you want

10 times higher at tier 9 is what i want ->  10 = 29 * e^(0.3715*9*modifier)

rearrange the equation -> modifier = LN (10*29) / (0.3715*9) = 1.695792111

That makes it easier to avoid crazy research costs

Dude I am not army computer right now (its broken anyways) but there is one file called game pace defs that has research pace values for all civs. You can alter it to make the very slow setting be as slow as you want or make a very very slow setting if you desire. Saves you alot of time.

you can alter production rates too or make it so only do shipyards produce slower, whatever you want you can do it.without editing every tech value.

DARCA

Yes, this is how it works, you need x amount as defined in TechAgeDefs.xml (default 12 to enter Age of War) techs for a race to enter each age. An age is specific to each player, it is not global.

No, don't worry, the base values come from the Tech Trees. There may be minor cost differences or discrepancies between similar techs amongst the trees, I haven't looked too closely, but most seem the same. The only modifiers based on race/civ are their racial bonuses like clever/productive etc. Custom races can pick these also. Those bonuses are minor in practice as they only amount to a basic factory or lab per planet.

Well put and most of us here already know about pacingdefs and it isnt the fix we want or a fix that will help.  Its basically like going up a big hill...put down enough research and you break over it...instead, changing the tech values to a higher number, will slow it down to a  reasonable level(or whatever reasonable is to you).

Quoting DARCA1213,

reply 41

Hmmm... Seems that with old galciv percentages mattered more. Now like you said (and I forgot) the percentage becomes less effects when you have more positive ones from labs. Might be possible to have actual rp deducted and percentages? Or devs could make the pacing be the last in the algorithm? Then again, it won't matter as you will always have the same amount of rp. Observe: 20p * (100% - 50%) = 30rp. 20p * 100% - 50% = 30rp

So I can the problem of slowing the game, with every colony and RP it gets harder to keep the game slow. Sorry.

 

DARCA

Actually there is a way you can cut total research points by a total percentage like you suggest and I mentioned this before. It can be applied directly to your faction. It's the same way the Research Cloisters, Quantum Research Foundation and Ascension Gate work (which I am certain HAS to be a bug!) Currently if your total civilization is producing 10,000 research, these buildings increase it 50%/100%/200% to 15,000/20,000/30,000 respectively. Not to mention you can exploit this and have all three buildings at once to bump 10,000 research to 45,000...

I've modified these buildings in my game as I consider them game breaking.

The problem with using this mechanic, as I said above, is that it will hamper you too much early game to make it effective at the end. 50% reduction will make techs at end game take two turns not one (not a big deal) but early game 30 turns instead of 15 is a big difference.

The way forward is by using the built in tech inflation mechanic the game uses. Currently, research costs are increased for every technology you unlock. Costs are also modified by how many habitable planets are in your galaxy (this took a while for me to figure out, it appears hardcoded in the game and I thought my discrepancies were due to galaxy size at first). I'm reluctant to modify these until I completely crack the formula however as I don't want to get to end game and have insane research times due to exponential inflation.

Gathering data is time consuming but over the last couple of days I've made progress. I'm having some problems with the exponential increases however and might have to ask someone with superior mathematic skills to assist me.

Thanks for the encouragement! Even though I'm doing this for myself it's nice to know it can potentially benefit others.

Good news is I cracked the formula about 5 minutes ago!

Just a couple more things to double check now and I'll share my findings.

OK, I thought I had it pinned down exactly but I'm off by about 1% which I'll try to find when it bugs me more than tires me to look at. The problem is the habitable planes modifier.

Currently the game uses a set of mechanics to modify the base tech costs we all see in the TechDef files:

• Global tech costs are increased for every technology you unlock
• "Tree" tech costs are increased for each technology you unlock in the related "Tree" (Colony, Warfare, Engineering, Government)
• Specialization tech costs are increased for each specialization unlocked along the parent branch
• Technology costs are increased or decreased depending on the total number of habitable planets in your system

The default values for these can be found in GalCiv3GlobalDefs.xml:

The most important one to look at is the TechInflationExponent_All and TechInflationMultiplier_All. I suggest leaving the others at their default values.

The formula I am giving below is an approximation as I haven't been able to exactly pinpoint the equation for habitable planets. My approximation is throwing the costs involving the multiplier out by about 1% but that's not much in the grand scheme of things since all else seems to be accurate.

What I have got is:

Research Cost = b + (t+4)^e + (t+4)*b*m*p

b = base research cost from the TechDef
t = techs unlocked as shown at the bottom of the tech screen
e = TechInflationExponent_All
m = TechInflationMultiplier_All
p = planet modifier

where (note this is an approximation)

p = 1 + (number of habitable planets over 50)/100 + (number of habitable planets over 100)/400

So as an example:

b = 821 (Cultural Affinity)
t = 180 (Techs unlocked)
e = 1.2 (default exponent)
m = 0.12 (default multiplier)
p = 1.25 (75 habitable planets)

Research Cost = 821 + (180+4)^1.2 + (180+4)*821*0.12*1.25 = 24003

This value will be additionally increased by the "Tree" inflation settings, depending on how many other technologies in that tree (Government in this case) have been unlocked. It will not be affected by the specialization settings since it's a core technology.

I haven't looked at the tree and specialisation tech costs too closely besides to assess what they affect. However, the math appears simplistic at first glance with them being a simple multiplier and exponent.

So how do we apply this to our games? I think it's going to be a little trial and error with the various effects compounding inflation on top of inflation. The default values Stardock has set don't seem high at first glance but you can see from the example above how much they are actually inflating costs even if we can't see it. Adjusting this values is going to come down to personal preference but in the first game I'm about to start I'm going to set the exponent to 2.0 and the multiplier to 0.2.

Also be warned that I'm unsure how this is going to affect the AI. there are various balancing issues we might need to consider like tech trading (adjusting the value AIs place on tech) and for those on higher difficulties the free war technologies the AI can receive each turn. In most cases I think this will be detrimental to the AIs since most people that want slower research will specialise their planets and the AI doesn't (at least not well).

Haha, I wish, IE crashed just as I finished the post and I had to quickly take a screenprint and retype it all!

Fixed it now.