To T_
from 
JoeUser Forums
JoeUser Forums
(Edited)
My response:
1) I do understand the risks, that at any moment they (US Soldier) could die. I *DO* care for their lives. In the same apsect, I *DO* care for the iraqi's lives, and want them to have freedom, and not be constantly in danger of death, etc... I support *freedom*, *liberty*, NOT war. IF there was any other way to bring others freedom, then lets use that instead of war. I realize that the latter isn't always available and that war is sometimes necessary. Now, that doesn't mean that we (US) have to hold their hand. Once they (Iraq) are capable of maintaining the 'fight' themselves, then, we should completely leave. Even withdrawing troops a little bit at a time would work for me. To paraphrase what another blogger (I believe it was parated2k) said: "We went in, we are doing a job, we need to finish the job." (I apologize if the quote is off in anyway)
2) I didn't use a graphic photo of a *soldier*. The photo in question, IMO, expresses what i feel, and what i believe the purpose of bring freedom to iraq is.
My degree to which sending a loved one or close friend over to iraq is different than yours, I admit that, i was wrong in saying otherwise. Does that mean though, that my feelings for them is any les than yours for your husband? I don't know, why, because i don't know what your relationship is like. I can understand that a husband-wife relationship is much more intense/bonding. I'm sure you care for him, thats obvious, but i care for those i know that are or were in the military. To say that I don't is insulting.
3)I never intended to speak for the military. I apologize.
4)I'm working on the 'expressing viewpoints articulately' part. I do understand, and do regard what i said with seriousness. Thats why i said it. (Not as clearly as i should've) Its cause i care. And no, i don't drink.
5)Yes, I am of age. And yes, I have a reasonable reason of why i cannot enlist. My health. It will take time for you, or anyone to believe me. If need be, i can take photos of my various equipment to prove my health condition, if that's what is needed. And yes, i would love to be over their and helping with whatever i can.
I assumed it was me.
There are those, (Who i despise) who would say the soldiers in question were "foolish" enough to follow an administration which lied,etc... Thats how i see that. There will be those who as you said, still view the soldiers as heroic, regardless of the administration, to them, actions mean more than words. I feel that way. (the latter) Thats why i am concerned with those assholes who talk the talk, and don't/haven't walked the walk.
How so? In that those that i know who are/were in the military don't happen to be 'as close' as a husband-wife relationship?
Perhaps I did 'pass judgement'. I apologize. I didn't view it as that at the time.
Experiencing it, sure. Contributing to war, i.e. fighting, yes you are correct. But, I helped the soldiers.
But you can divorce yourself from the continuous cycle of doing the same things over and over.
Yes I do have that history. But, I've buried the hatchet. Not forgotten it. I'm sorry to say that you are wrong in your assumption.
-lucas
1. You take every opportunity to talk smack about Iraq and the military. You do your pro-war cheerleader routine (or conversely, your anti-war cheerleader routine) with such callousness that even though you mouth support for the troops, you actually don't care what happens to any given Soldier. You laud their sacrifices while showing complete disregard for their lives.
2. You use graphic photos of Soldiers or even dead civilians to illustrate your political points (again, this runs both ways). You justify this by claiming that people need to see it.
3. You speak for the military, telling other what the service members would want. I've been guilty of this before, and in truth I can only speak for myself and to a lesser extent for my husband. This tactic is seen on both sides of the spectrum as well.
4. You express your viewpoints inarticulately, with minimal thought put into them, and with complete disregard for the fact that what you are discussing is real and that real people's lives are in the balance. You fail to recognize or express the gravity of the topic matter. You talk about the war with the same detachedness and fervor that you would use when debating a buddy over which brand of beer tastes better. (Libs and Conservatives alike)
5. You are of enlistment age, particularly healthy, and particularly male, and yet, despite all your vocal, careless rantings, you have excuses why you cannot enlist. You proclaim that you would love to be over there and that you would enlist and serve in a heartbeat...but... There's always a "but" with pasty piles of goo.
To the individual who assumed I was referring to him in my war article...I was not. I apologize for making you feel indicted by my article. You don't fit the profile. I've never considered you one of the pro-war blowhards that so irk me. I think you approach the issue with intelligence and sensitivity.
My response:
1) I do understand the risks, that at any moment they (US Soldier) could die. I *DO* care for their lives. In the same apsect, I *DO* care for the iraqi's lives, and want them to have freedom, and not be constantly in danger of death, etc... I support *freedom*, *liberty*, NOT war. IF there was any other way to bring others freedom, then lets use that instead of war. I realize that the latter isn't always available and that war is sometimes necessary. Now, that doesn't mean that we (US) have to hold their hand. Once they (Iraq) are capable of maintaining the 'fight' themselves, then, we should completely leave. Even withdrawing troops a little bit at a time would work for me. To paraphrase what another blogger (I believe it was parated2k) said: "We went in, we are doing a job, we need to finish the job." (I apologize if the quote is off in anyway)
2) I didn't use a graphic photo of a *soldier*. The photo in question, IMO, expresses what i feel, and what i believe the purpose of bring freedom to iraq is.
My degree to which sending a loved one or close friend over to iraq is different than yours, I admit that, i was wrong in saying otherwise. Does that mean though, that my feelings for them is any les than yours for your husband? I don't know, why, because i don't know what your relationship is like. I can understand that a husband-wife relationship is much more intense/bonding. I'm sure you care for him, thats obvious, but i care for those i know that are or were in the military. To say that I don't is insulting.
3. You speak for the military, telling other what the service members would want. I've been guilty of this before, and in truth I can only speak for myself and to a lesser extent for my husband. This tactic is seen on both sides of the spectrum as well.
3)I never intended to speak for the military. I apologize.
4. You express your viewpoints inarticulately, with minimal thought put into them, and with complete disregard for the fact that what you are discussing is real and that real people's lives are in the balance. You fail to recognize or express the gravity of the topic matter. You talk about the war with the same detachedness and fervor that you would use when debating a buddy over which brand of beer tastes better. (Libs and Conservatives alike)
4)I'm working on the 'expressing viewpoints articulately' part. I do understand, and do regard what i said with seriousness. Thats why i said it. (Not as clearly as i should've) Its cause i care. And no, i don't drink.
5. You are of enlistment age, particularly healthy, and particularly male, and yet, despite all your vocal, careless rantings, you have excuses why you cannot enlist. You proclaim that you would love to be over there and that you would enlist and serve in a heartbeat...but... There's always a "but" with pasty piles of goo.
5)Yes, I am of age. And yes, I have a reasonable reason of why i cannot enlist. My health. It will take time for you, or anyone to believe me. If need be, i can take photos of my various equipment to prove my health condition, if that's what is needed. And yes, i would love to be over their and helping with whatever i can.
To the individual who assumed I was referring to him in my war article...I was not. I apologize for making you feel indicted by my article. You don't fit the profile. I've never considered you one of the pro-war blowhards that so irk me. I think you approach the issue with intelligence and sensitivity.
I assumed it was me.
How would it make anyone but the current administration look like fools? And the value of a life is not measured by the outcome of the Iraq war. The men and women who have died in Iraq have personal value based on their choices and relationships with others. If they died heroically, or were good people, nothing will change that.
There are those, (Who i despise) who would say the soldiers in question were "foolish" enough to follow an administration which lied,etc... Thats how i see that. There will be those who as you said, still view the soldiers as heroic, regardless of the administration, to them, actions mean more than words. I feel that way. (the latter) Thats why i am concerned with those assholes who talk the talk, and don't/haven't walked the walk.
Lucas, you are so far removed from this.
How so? In that those that i know who are/were in the military don't happen to be 'as close' as a husband-wife relationship?
Perhaps I did 'pass judgement'. I apologize. I didn't view it as that at the time.
Writing letters to Soldiers is not even remotely similar to experiencing the effect of the war or contributing to it. What did you donate to your National Guard branch? When? Details, please?
Experiencing it, sure. Contributing to war, i.e. fighting, yes you are correct. But, I helped the soldiers.
No, Lucas, you talked out of your ass here and I called you on it. Your past is a part of who you are, and everyone's dealings with you is colored by the lies, the venom, the childishness, and the dishonesty you've displayed here. You can't divorce yourself from your actions.
But you can divorce yourself from the continuous cycle of doing the same things over and over.
You have a history of posting whatever you think will get you the most attention, Lucas. You reinvent yourself to get attention and attaboys from the people on this site. You're transparent. This is obviously a bid to get the pro-war folks on here to like you and give you attention.
Yes I do have that history. But, I've buried the hatchet. Not forgotten it. I'm sorry to say that you are wrong in your assumption.
-lucas
