[Idea]Global Mana Soft and Hard caps

from Elemental Forums

    I have posted before I am not a big fan of the way global mana has been implemented but it looks like it is here to stay so I have a suggestion for a way to balance it.  Simply put make mana caps per anything that generates mana. 

For instance:

Sov 1 Generates 2 mana per turn and has a max mana cap of 100.

This mana camp could even tie into the Sovereigns level something like 10*level capped at 100 (maybe 200).

Shard is captured that gives 100 (Maybe 200) additional mana capacity allowing for more mana to use between different casting types.

Have a hard global mana cap of 1000 which you could also make casting the spell of making that cost.

Also mana regen building could also increase the global cap by an amount comparable to how much mana they regen say 5 to 1 (or 10 to 1).

So a level 10 Sov with a mana regen building of +2 (using 10 to 1) and 2 shards captured (using 100) would have a global mana capped at 100 + 20 + 200 = 320 Mana.

This would limit mana.

Obviousley all numbers are subject to change for balance sake.

If this were implemented I would kick the mana regen rate up greatly, leave the caps in place, increase mana costs greatly per spell, and increase magic damage.

This would allow for more magic to be used to greater effect but limit how much you could use per battle.

 

My 2 copper.

 

Edit:  Revision of the idea, potentially remove the hard cap and only have a soft cap so that to expand total mana cap you would have to build improvements to help focus for the channeler.

6,246 views 8 replies
Reply #1 from Elemental Forums Top

Is this not something that is feasible at this time or is it already possible to mod in?

Reply #2 from Elemental Forums Top

I'm not sure if it could be modded in. As for having it as a feature in the un-modded game, I think it really is just a "different" design decision. I mean not better, not worse, just different.

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Reply #3 from Elemental Forums Top

I'm not much of a fan of being limited in my storage of mana, although I would take more mana regeneration, overall I don't really have many comments except a mana cap would even further boost the power of enchantments, which IMO is some of the most powerful magical tools available outside path of the mage.

So the spells would need to be balanced around a high mana generating system with a ceiling, and I think that is too much, but I dunno, as HF said its a different design decision.

Sincerely
~ Kongdej

Reply #4 from Elemental Forums Top

    The main problems I see with both E:WoM and FE appear to both have a root problem of uncontrollable scaling for certain stats.  I.E. Sov. Hps and then huge mana pools that are effectively infinite later in the game.  Basically this prevents the infinite mana pool scenario.  Is it the best scenario, no.  I personally believe a dual mana system, global and tactical, would have been the best but with the current swing of development this is no longer feasible unless it is unlocked.  This and re-allowing stats to be used instead of attack, defense, accuracy, and dodge.  Make those derived stats based on base stats (STR, DEX, ...) would be the best combination in my opinion, but I digress.  For this idea of capped mana would be a way of say making a level 1 Sov have a Global mana cap of say 10 and mana regen of 2 or even 5.  So in a fight he is able to cast 10 mana worth of spells and if he was battled again the next turn would be able to use 5 mana worth of spells. 

     Enchantments are something I have always had a problem with as I think they should just cost a LOT of mana and be permanent except combat enchants.  By having the enchants cost a lot of mana it limits being able to cast them until the global mana pool cap exceeds the cost of the enchant.  Then limit the number of enchants per city/unit but have no upkeep.  This will also go along with the uncontrollable scaling factor I mentioned earlier; +1 of a bonus from an enchant is much easier to balance than +10%.  Several multipliers scale badly versus several +1's.

     For reference I do like what has been done with the game even if some things I liked were removed.  With help this game will be what we all hope it will be the best 4X Fantasy game for a long time.

Once again this is all my 2 copper.

Reply #5 from Elemental Forums Top

I don't follow, you want to limit mana pool stuff in a way where I cannot save up mana for important things like epic battles, but boost mana regeneration so small battles will never be a problem mana wise.

But you also want enchants to be upkeep free, while you are afraid of all the uncontrollable numbers going wild... What is a more uncontrollable number than free enchants on everything? O_o

Personally I never have "Unlimited Mana", people have unlimited mana if they neglect to use one of the resources given to them throughout the game... But then again, if that is a problem we could take a look at metal, gildar, horses and wargs too.

Sincerely
~ Kongdej

Reply #6 from Elemental Forums Top

     The numbers given are arbitrary but a finite cap on an item makes for better strategy than just lets get a huge lump before we do anything.  You are right about metal, gildar and other resources and if possible I would put a cap per city on those resources as you need to store them somewhere but once again this is only my opinion.  What would you say would be an appropriate number for a mana cap.  For materials cap that is something that could be based upon city type and size.  Enclaves could even give a boost to global mana cap.  Hmmm, the more I think about it why not not make a hard cap and just make it a cap by buildings so that you are still limited by development but as you said it is still possible to create a larger mana pool.  I would still keep the mana regen high for the initial leveling and eventually mana regen becomes a moot point due to additional mana regen buildings.  Unless you are in successive epic magic battles then you could be hurting.

     For enchants when I mean limiting the total number of enchants I mean only one or at the most two.  If two they have to be of different types to prevent stacking problems.  I am not sure to be honest for unit enchants, as unit balancing is yet to be fleshed out fully in the beta, I am just referring to resource management aspect of the game for mana and as you mentioned materials esq.

Reply #7 from Elemental Forums Top

Well, I just think it's a different approach. You are sort of forcing the player into using magic. With the current system, we have to consider if we want to use it in the future, or use it now. That's something that is lost with your system, because it has limited room to store mana. As I said, not really a worse system but not better either - just different.

Reply #8 from Elemental Forums Top

Hard caps are not at all fun. If I want to bank my mana for that upcoming war I have planned, then that is a strategic choice I should be able to make.