[Balance/Suggestion] 0.77 Faction Soldier Base Stats

Wow, great, thanks.  I was wondering about this.  Also, Doesn't Resolin get weak troops on top of already being weak ass troops?  Has anyone noticed if this has caused them to be a weak nation overall?

Thanks for the overview. I was wondering about this.

There is a slight error in the table and in the text, Gildens constitution is 11. And both Gilden and Paridien have a total attribute value of 34

I think this is one area that the devs balanced well and early on. I would like to hear from people that play many factions about how they think things stack up. Is there a faction that is getting screwed?

Resolin have weak troops in the sense that they only have 7 strength; the lowest of the factions. Magnar is the faction that is themed to be swarmy. This is accomplished by using the negative traits to bring cost down.

Sorry about the errors in the table. I couldn't get it to alternate the row colors when i pasted it in so i botched my Pariden analysis. I wanted to bring this info to everyone's attention and see two major things

1. Do these stats feel balanced?

2. Is there a difference in how the factions troops play?

I think you mean Umber, with the 1/2 unit maintenance trait.

Honestly, between the power of the heroes and the weakness of the AI, I haven't noticed any significant difference between troops for any of the factions.

I've played a different race each game, shrug.

Bump good info

I think for Resolyn, we should either increase constitution, intelligence, or Dex by 2.

I would suggest either +2 to intelligence for lore, or +2 to constitution for balance. (or +1 Int, +1 con)

Also, I agree that Dexterity should perhaps affect Accuracy in some way. (in a similar way how Strength normally affects attack?)

Thanks for the awesome chart

Troops in beta are too raw for any meaningful analysis.

Just comparing stats though i'd say that Dex and Intelligence need a subtle boost. (Int giving dmg resistance to spells, Dodge/Acc reworked)

Well, I think Dex could easily cover both Accuracy and Dodge (at least in part, all units need some level of accuracy, regardless of Dex)

meanwhile, Magic is an entirely different story

Do we have intelligence be everything? Resist, Power, Magic Defense, Magic damage boost?

Somehow I think giving everything to intelligence might be too strong. Fireball is already strong enough with Evocation III, do we need to add an intelligence based damage boost to that? xD

Evoker is the most game breaking trait in the game. A lv  4 mage hero can reach Max spell Dmg, evoker/Spell cost reduction trait are the only 2 mage abilities worth getting and always will be with current system

Kill/change/nerf it and add Int bonus Damage/Resistance instead

Remove evoker and make INT enhance spell damage.

Sounds good, I suppose.

Or just balance the evoker trait :-/

Well, the thing is that Intelligence doesn't seem a 'good enough' choice. And if all it does it make your 'slow' spell more likely to succeed, then I don't blame them.

I don't mind having the evoker traits, I mean they could either be less effective or just do something different, but I think making Int and Dex stronger is a bit more important than keeping all the traits just for the sake of keeping them.

(that being said, I like traits, but new ones can be made and old ones can be destroyed, if necessary)

I have to play beta 2 before I can say for sure, but I think race should have some more drastic stat differences. .77 offers very little advantage or difference to stats. 

I don't like the hidden base stats. It is confusing and most people probably won't even notice it. It also cuts down on players ability to create custom factions. Rather all the differences between faction stats should be set by faction traits.

Or just have them visible in the UI ...

Even Tolkien noted that elves are more dexterous and that hobbits were excellent climbers. Why would races not be significantly different? You can make your own races. The problem is that it is not clear to the newer users. It also seems like they tried to balance the stats, when they should have looked at balancing the effects of those stats. -1 or +.5 to damage is pretty irrelevant. It doesn't need to factor into unit designs at all. I would like to see some more meaningful ability differences.

Where is the race that excels at archers?

Where is the race that excels at crits?

Where is the race that are excellent fighters, but are weak in mind? (Trogs, but they don't show it enough to count.)

The other problem is that these stats are the only difference between races. They need special traits to emphasize their attributes. Factions need special techs and items that add to this. At least one faction should get a special horse. But don't call it Xia's Pony. 

I'm not sure that any civ currently has a 'specialty' in mounted ... that may come later if they add an extra 'nomadic' race or something.

For now though, I think its clear that some of the Fallen Races may prefer the Harridan Spider or the Frog-Lizard thing as a mount, but really ... those are only for heroes iirc.

The death mage faction would be the Spider focused one, while either magnar or the one with a half-dragon Sovereign would be interested in the Frog-lizards.

I think the Tarth would be specialists in criticals and dodging. While I think their preference is in Bows, I think it would also lend towards having excellent assassins.

One of the Fallen races should also excell in assassins ... although that should come from raw Dexterity bonuses I think. (maybe the dark elves? or are those the death mages. If they are maybe they can be the death mages with the good assassins too)

Edit: (below is Faction based, not racial ... )

I think Capitar's racial   Faction ability could be having cheaper unit maintenance ... while Gilden's racial ability could be either a bonus to gold or having cheaper city maintenance. (as in free slums in every city, or in capital, or in largest 3 cities)

To wrap it up, I agree with Sean that races should have more than just stat-differences ... but abilities and effects as well.

The differences between Vampires, Elves, Dwarves, and Orcs are interesting. Some are weak to fire or life magic, others are immune to death magic, and some are resistant to fire magic (as an example).

I suppose some Fallen could be weak to fire and immune to death while others could be resistant to fire. Some could have higher stats and yet be weak to all elements.

Pariden, for instance, could have a race (Amarian?) which has resistances to all the elements yet have weaker stats (for regular combat).

Also, I think you should be able to pick a Sovereign which is of a different race than the Faction he or she is leading.

For instance, a Magnar ruling over humans ... or some such thing.

I agree. I plan on creating at lest 50 custom Factions once the game is released (unless it reverts to being a flop like WOM) and I would like to mave them each different and many faction traits to choose from would go a long way in making this so.

I have over 60 different custom factions in GC2 and loved it. I hope to do so in this game.