Lack of one resource - destined to lose

Since 1.08 I’ve notice some resource shortages. Pre 1.08 this usually wasn’t a problem, but with the food balance reducing city spamming, producing materials is a more of a challenge and it really slows down empire/city growth. I usually play every game to the end, but since the patch I had to restart 2 or 3 times because I could not find any materials. I find this odd given that there is old growth, clay pits, and marble, there should be something for me to use close to the starting point. Has anyone had the same experience?

Thinking of the multiplayer issue, players would get really ticked if they are missing one resource near starting location and lose the game because of it. Lack of food, materials, libraries or gold early game are all pretty much game losing impacts.  (Yes, some people will be able to fight out of that situation, but it could be reasonably said that missing one resource is such a disadvantage that you are destined to lose.) 

To mitigate this, I suggest a tech research that allows you to research the location of resources that the player can pick, instead of pre-selected ones. That way if you are short on materials, you can find a materials source.  Short on tech, you can pick libraries. If you have everything you need, you can pick gold etc…The suspension of disbeleif approach would be to explain that researchers are scouring the archives for a resource of your choosing.

OR, for materials specifically, suggest the wood shop produce materials (instead of a +10%).  Instead of using old growth forests, use the plain forests, but they have to be within the area of influence of the town with the wood shop.

8,776 views 18 replies
Reply #1 Top

The only element I typically have a hard time finding is metal (not materials), sometimes I go over 100 turns without metal, luckily it's not used as much to build units & things because I haven't had problems with the lack of it.

Reply #2 Top

Quoting cpl_rk, reply 1
The only element I typically have a hard time finding is metal (not materials), sometimes I go over 100 turns without metal, luckily it's not used as much to build units & things because I haven't had problems with the lack of it.

I'n my opinion crystal is more important than shards because you can design units using the magic stuff that require crystal, which significanly increases the strength of squads. Crystal & shards are very hard to come by, but this is the way it should be for these things, other things not so much. Reducing food supplies is an arbitrary method of helping the AI (by decreasing city spam), but you can get around this with those adventure techs that reveal additional food resources (wheat & hives).

 

.. it seems that sometimes when I click "edit" on this forum it'll duplicate my posts instead of just allowing me to edit? Have any of you experienced this?

Reply #3 Top

It's absurd you can't trade resources on the market.

Reply #4 Top

When ever im without something I just take it from someone else. :/

Works pretty well in elemental.

Reply #5 Top

I really like the idea that the Adventure tech would open a screen where you could pick what resource you need each time you open a new "step" in the tree.  Great idea!  It would allow a LOT of flexibility and make the game FUN instead of frustrating plus offering flexibility in play styles.

Hope SD picks this up!

Reply #6 Top

Yeah, a lot of variability in resources.  Once [1.08] I had a game with no gold node at the start, and none nearby, even with exploration tech.  If you are weak enough 30 or so turns into the game with sparse, disparate and poorly defended cities, the AIs tend to gang up on you I think.

A way the adventure tech could compensate for lack of a certain resource is to allow the player to choose what reward they get for a quest, i.e. either a silver flute, gold, food, materials, whatever.  Maybe make reward choice a level 2 or 3 adventure tech so you have to commit to adventuring a little, but not too bad if you are struggling out of the starting gate. 

This is an issue but I also like the randomness of your starting situation, and wouldn't want to change that.

Reply #7 Top

Have not had an issue getting materials, crystal and metal tend to be harder to find, even with high levels of material. Have had to pay a lot more attention to food too, had some troops dessert over  negative food / gold after conquering a city. I now tend to raze cities I capture often and just start new settlements if I need to expand.

Reply #8 Top

I'm in a game now that I have no metal and no crystals, with an empire of 10 cities.  I took over a neutral city because they produced 2 metals.  If the AI were to declare war and take that city first, I would very screwed.  Are there any techs that cause new crystal or iron resources to spawn?  I thought there was, and I thought I was choosing them, but they never spawned anything...but I am easily confused...

Reply #9 Top

At about 200th turn I have tons of materials and I don't really know what to do with them. In every game. I can sell them once to minor faction but what then? I agree that the metal and crystal are hard to get in 1.08. Last game I've got my first metal mine after about 400 turns by research of ventri mine. 

Reply #10 Top

Quoting Lord, reply 8
I'm in a game now that I have no metal and no crystals, with an empire of 10 cities.  I took over a neutral city because they produced 2 metals.  If the AI were to declare war and take that city first, I would very screwed.  Are there any techs that cause new crystal or iron resources to spawn?  I thought there was, and I thought I was choosing them, but they never spawned anything...but I am easily confused...

 

Some of the high level Adventure techs may.

 

That said, don't discount the power of cannon fodder. I beat armies of axe wielding warriors with base staff wielding warriors at no loss due to cheap, plentiful numbers and high skill level. Combine that with a decent champion, it can seem unexciting but don't discount them.

Reply #11 Top

I don't mind specific resource scarcity, it makes you adapt rather than play the same every game. If low on materials you have to bias away from materials expensive buildings and troops, same with metals and crystals. Naturally you pick your military/expansion targets accordingly

Playing as empire, who only get 1 material through buildings, I've had plenty of games with no special material resources for a long time - I used the creatures available through the Negotiation branch as they only have gold cost.

Reply #13 Top

Quoting Droghar, reply 11
I don't mind specific resource scarcity, it makes you adapt rather than play the same every game. If low on materials you have to bias away from materials expensive buildings and troops, same with metals and crystals. Naturally you pick your military/expansion targets accordingly

Playing as empire, who only get 1 material through buildings, I've had plenty of games with no special material resources for a long time - I used the creatures available through the Negotiation branch as they only have gold cost.

 

This is a pretty good point.  I got nothing to add other than to agree.

Reply #14 Top

on Kindom under cival you are able to make a bulding that provides a bunch of material.  First tech on I believe it is called production

Reply #15 Top

Currently, I don't think there's an issue.  So long as you have enough essence, you can make due with any amount of shortages on the other resources.  With essence alone you can maintain a big army, conquer foes, and capture new areas.  Go a few steps up the magic tech path to get an essence bonus and you're in business.  If you're low on resources and feel crippled, this is the way to go.

Theh developers have made clear they're going to iron this out, and that presents some issues.  I've never had material shortages (save for some early-game hiccups), but I've had severe gold and metal problems before.  The big problem with gold is that all the decent military units are exorbitantly expensive here, but once you do have them they pretty much decimate all the cheap low-end stuff.  Once summons and channelers can no longer carry a faction, I'm actually afraid gold could very well become the end-all resource.

Metal is pretty bad if you're missing it, but I've found that usually I can lean on archers and get away without it.  Food is also pretty nasty to be low on, but I've found that this just makes me be more careful about where I place my cities, and I can almost always get by.

 

I think we need some options for more material-intensive units in the early-game to present an alternative to the gold-intensive units like archers and metal-intensive units like armored swordsmen.  Right now there's simply no way to put large amounts of materials to use, so people who do have excess of them can build up obscene amounts like 1000 materials and still be unable to buy anything because they have maybe 20 gold.

 

I've found the rarest resource to be mounts.  My last three game maps have been completely devoid of any mount resources.

Reply #16 Top

The units you get through Diplomacy and the empire equivalent cost only gold.

Reply #17 Top

Quoting StarReaper, reply 4
When ever im without something I just take it from someone else. :/

Works pretty well in elemental.

Hope it doesn't work for you in real life, though ;)

 

Asmodean

Reply #18 Top

i agree that resources should be reexamined.  there needs to be a way to get them, without sacrificing the exploration/challenge of the game.  this should be at a considerable cost to the player.