5 patches later: 1 enemy ship > 50 TEC heavy cruisers

The subverter got a nerf in the beta patch.

They are actual geniuses, because they created a ship that you know is dangerous, and yet you still ignore it and let it disable all of your ships.

Congrats!

Now if you'd actually care to stop whining for a little while, you can easily figure out that a) their disable radius is pretty narrow, so it's your own fault for clumping all yous ships together, they can't disable capitals, so it's your own fault that you haven't destroyed or disabled these paper thin ships, c) they are very antimatter dependant and since you're playing TEC, a few zaps from the Dunov and they'll be dry.

I don't know why you keep buying these games, that, I don't know - actually make you think for a little bit instead of throwing ships at something and hope you win

Not to put it bluntly, but you spammed one particular type of unit, and you payed for it. That's basically what happened.

Mix in a few caps and subverters are nothing to worry about.

Will you play me in MP?

Did you actually read what I wrote? How about this part: "I target subverters only and they keep resupplying them" . Or how about "and conventiantly they clump themselves together, even though their orders are for Loose formation".

Really if the enemy has 10 subverters coming at me, it doesnt matter how spread out I am. They can still cover enough area to disable all my ships.




20 seconds is still a decisive advantage, especially since multiple subverters can still spam the ability as they come in.

It takes time to build up 200 antimatter. Especially after a jump or two.

I have ALL my caps sitting behind those cruisers. That is 10 Kol Battleships, 2 Akkan Batltecruisers and 4 Dunov Battlecruisers. And yes those ships are targeting the subverters aswell, but they cannot take them all out at the same time, so some get close enough to disable my fleet, and since they keep coming my non-cap's keep getting constantly disabled and destroyed. This leads to a very poor kill to loss ratio as my firepower is greatly reduced.

May I suggest that you pull back what ships you can to a different location and ambush their with a few EMP and Ions. Also try fighting at a range with missiles ships or just run the other fleet around till they run out of antimatter.

TEC vessels aren't very antimatter reliant. Epically if you have a balanced variety that makes up for each ships short comings and researched the right technology.

Swarming with one class of ship is only an invitation to get beat. Though it sounds like the other guy had a pretty good tactic, he did the same as you in a way.

This is just off the top of my head since I haven't played seriously in a while, but wouldn't Cobalts be able to slow, if not stop Subverters with their Sabotage Reactor ability?

Just have the Cobalts come in from a different angle so your opponent has to choose to disable them, or your main battle fleet.

Not to be too blunt...But, YOU ARE A MORON.

You spammed all HCs...Oh gosh...maybe if short range ships don't do well against your opponent, you could try something different...Ever thought of that? What about Javalis? Or do u just like to ignore obvious solutions and be a bitch on the forums?

Dude all you need is to throw in some Javelins and those subverters are toast. Just put them in a separate fleet and select both fleets and assign them to a group. They will have a hard time disabling those LRMs from that far away.

Have you looked at that pic? See the two separate fleets? Short ranged ships group up at the front. Long range ships group up at the back. That does not change the fact that 1 ship can take out 50 of ANY non-capital ship.

Killing them is not a problem. The problem is if I get 9 out of 10 killed in time, that 1 remaining one is still enough to take out all my front line ships and keep them disabled for long enough for the enemy to cause me severe losses. Rinse and repeat my losses are far more significant than the enemies. This would not be a problem if my ships actually obeyed formation orders and stayed Loose.

Honestly, I'd think it would be better if the Subverter locked down ships individually with a drastically reduced AM cost and cooldown and a longer duration, but I doubt that's something that will be changed.

As for formations, could Annekynn have a point? I mean, I gave up on them probably back in 1.02 as the difference they made in ship spacing was ever so slight.

I ran into a similar problem when I was getting my 'Fear of Icebergs' medal. My remedy, Carrier Crusiers(and this was pre-beta). Mix in some Carriers to cover the slower Heavy Cruisers. Having a few of the Heavy Cruisers out of fleet formation can also cut down on how many get caught up in the blast.

I think the reason why they are all grouping together is because you have them all set to attack the same ship....

The tactic I would use here would be to have three fleets:

1st fleet : Long range and caps, with a few scatterings of others for balance
2nd and 3rd fleets: your HC's, 1 or 2 caps each, and some others for balance.

Jump the 1st fleet in and take out as many of the subverters as you can, then jump your 2nd and 3rd fleets in, one to the far left of the PL and one to the far right of the PL and have them swarm in.

That should eliminate getting your fleets mass subverted.

Stardock has balance every ship properly, they can't help you if you start making YOUR fleet unbalanced. Its a player's stupidity thats the problem here, not a programming problem. Its called a strategy game you are suppose to build your fleet using strategic intel and actually think about how to make a balanced fleet to counter the opposition.

In theory yes. In practice what ends up happening is that once all the subverters are dead, my ships clump up if they arent clumped up already as they are given targets to attack and at no time do they try to spread out again. So the enemy brings in reinforcements mid battle, and suddenly im getting ambushed by subverters again. All it takes is for me to miss 1 of those things coming in, or have it stealth through the mass of enemy ships and bam, my clump of ships is now a clump of useless ships. Once that happens those ships get torn appart very quickly and the advantage swings to the enemy. Im forced to either retreat or wait for my rebuilt ships to stream in, all the while im undermanned and taking losses even faster.

This is only a problem fighting that one race. Fighting TEC or the other (as long as I kill the iconus guardians) is never a problem and is actually FUN as I dont have to micromanage the battle looking at each and every ship for that one subverter that will screw me.

You can spread them out yourself. If something isn't working, try something different.

I have tried manually unclumping them. Its tedious and annoying to do as it has to be done repeatedly. It also causes losses while the ships stop shooting, turn around, move to a spot, stop, and turn around again to face the enemy.

Yes, you need to micro against subverters. Oh noes. You've obviously never played starcraft if you think this level of micro is a problem =p. And yes, it does cause losses even when you adopt countermeasures...Thats why subverters are a great unit...But then again, Vasari receive the short end of the stick in so many ways, they deserve a great support cruiser IMO... I do agree they needed a nerf, and they have received one in the beta (although its too big a nerf, IMO)...

As people above describe, possible countermeasures include: spreading out your forces and KEEPING them spread out, using different range units such as HC/LRM, using units which EAT antimatter (such as the advent disciple if your that race)...All these things *greatly* reduce subverter effectiveness.

-Drexion

Wow, you spamtarded one unit and then got owned? Oh noez!!

lawl

I didnt play SC but I did play TA, a better game . Micro managing battles is tedious when youre playing a 100+ planet map with max races and have a lot to worry about.

Either way, ive solved my problem by simply modding the subverters right out of the game.

You fail at reading comprehension. This isnt Barrens chat.