Regarding Used Copies of GalCiv II

i say they should not be allowed to get ANY support..

the copy is licenced to the person not the computer and not the CD...

i think that because it is able to be downloded the seriel has to be treated as such

its too sad though

Yea, the larger problem is that stores like Gamestop/EB will take used software pretty much regardless of what it is, and resell it. (Used stuff is their cash cow.)

Yea, the larger problem is that stores like Gamestop/EB will take used software pretty much regardless of what it is, and resell it. (Used stuff is their cash cow.)

problem is.. how can you resell a game you can't make sure a copy can't be made of?

i mean.. you sell back your galciv game.. but you STILL HAVE THE SERIEL.. you can't resell that....



so you still ahve the game..

problem is.. how can you resell a game you can't make sure a copy can't be made of? i mean.. you sell back your galciv game.. but you STILL HAVE THE SERIEL.. you can't resell that....

That's a zero argument, you can't sell an audio cd or a book, etc with this argumentation.

It's illegal to sell the original and use than the backup copy.

In germany it's not possible to "personalize" a program sold on CD in a paperbox in a normal shop.
EULAs have no effect because the wording is not known at buytime.

You don't buy the game, you buy a license to use (play) the game. You don't own the game. The license is non-transferable.

That being said, of course it is unfair, but unfortunately that is how the software industry tends to work. I have good hope that this will change in the future, since games, and in fact any shrink-wrapped software is a commodity, and it should be possible to trade it like any other commodity.

Then again, you can sell your non-transferable non-refundable airline ticket to someone, doesn't mean they will be able to fly.

At least stardock doesn't use copy protection on the game. You can also download the 1.0X update without the serial number, so if you bought a used 1.0 retail version you can update it to that version. I doubt they will release 1.1 to the public, unless they start selling 1.1 retail. Finally, you can buy a new serial at a discount.

Other game publishers make all updates publicly available, but they use nasty copy protection software to protect the CDs or DVD. However, at least you can buy second-hand games and update them to the latest version. Stardock doesn't use copy protection, but instead you can't update your game beyond what they sold in retail boxes. Personally, I think that is the lesser of the two evils. The amount of time I wasted, er, spent playing the game so far is way way more than I spent working to earn the money to buy the game. In addition, it gives a good feeling to support a company which is less evil than most other software companies out there.

You don't buy the game, you buy a license to use (play) the game. You don't own the game. The license is non-transferable. That being said, of course it is unfair, but unfortunately that is how the software industry tends to work.

You're correct about buying a license, but the software industry does not tend to work that way. Normally the license is transferable. For example, you can view the Outlook EULA from the About box, and paragraph 14 states:

"... Transfer to Third Party. If you are the person who initially licensed the Software, you may make a one-time permanent transfer of this EULA, Software, and Certificate of Authenticity (if applicable) to another end-user, provided you do not retain any copies of this Software."

i feel stardock is perfect in this case..

they have a product.. its protected for the updates.. they are nto worrying abotu those that will pirate

they have made there EULA mean that you can't resell

i see a perfect game

If it would be so easy to forbid a resell of a computergame or another software then every software distributor would do it. I highly doubt that this would have even the slightest chance on any court of justice to get through.

GC2 is not the only game with an online activation. For example Earth2160 had it as well.

And if this registration means that you can't resell the game, then it's far worse than any copy protection.

You're probably fully in your legal right to sell and purchase used video games (see the Wikipedia article: First-sale doctrine), though there is confusion around this. However, Stardock is also within their rights to uphold their own EULA and deny support to those who violate it.

If you're buying a used copy of the game, be sure you can get the other person's Stardock account info or don't buy it. Tribes 2 was simliar, though Sierra actually reset accounts for people who could prove they physically own the game with the used serial number. I really don't like this attitude from Stardock

(Note: you can probably pick up the patches through less-than-legit channels)

My friend says take the game, remove the serial from the jewel box (so it doesn't come back to haunt you), and resell it as quick as you can before everyone catches on. He's such a Korx!!!

Oh, the ethical challenges a leader faces...

well.. i first got me a illigal copy from ... and looked if the game was fun. (that took me a short time.) after i saw that i liked the game i bought it. I always buy good games etc. Also i always try a demo (or illigal copy ) first and frankly... 70% of the games don't deliver what they promise. (or what i think they promise)
I admit that illegal software is wrong and should not be used. (but then... i would not have bought so many games after all) If serials should be transferrable is a difficult question. maybe there should be another way of making sure that a serial is only used by only 1 person. something like a PKI structure. "There can only be one"
however, if a game cannot be played (partially/demo) before i buy it, i probably won't buy it. to many games are of low quality and fairly high prices...

I would say that Stardock's reasoning is fair, but...

A warning should be put on the front cover of the case, perhaps saying "ONLY purchase this product new from a retailer". (Similar to food packets marked as "Do not purchase if this seal is broken")

Sorry to say that, but what cakruege said earlier is true.

I don`t know about other countries, but here in Germany EULAs aren`t worth the paper they are written on.
I can agree to whatever i like in an EULA and am not legally bound by it. So that means, if a game is published in Germany i can always resell it and whatever is said in an EULA is void. If you buy the CD here it means you buy the license, too.
If that is also true for other countries as well, i don`t know...

I would suppose that reselling copies can be made possible if the seller and buyer contact Stardock, and ask to de-activate the current serial number and then give a new serial number to the new buyer.

But beyond that, its not really possible.

END COMMUNICATION

Why would someone want to sell their copy of CalCiv II?!

Why would someone want to sell their copy of CalCiv II?!

good point.. you should never want to unless your hocking it for money to feed your kids

Why would someone want to sell their copy of CalCiv II?!

For many reasons....

Darklor

I would suppose that reselling copies can be made possible if the seller and buyer contact Stardock, and ask to de-activate the current serial number and then give a new serial number to the new buyer.

Actually we won't be entertaining these requests, for everyone's information. We don't make any additional revenue off re-sold copies and it costs us money to support these types of requests.

It's possible that in some countries you will actually be liable for not supporting this.

Yea, the larger problem is that stores like Gamestop/EB will take used software pretty much regardless of what it is, and resell it. (Used stuff is their cash cow.)

EB used to take used PC software.  Now they are simply flushing out thier used PC game stock; at least that is the case here in North Carolina.  I would guess the reason is due to licensing issues, also support on EB Games part dealing with missing discs, system requirements, people making copies and reslling the original back to EB, etc...  Used console games certainly do take up considerable shelf space though and they are far easier for EB to support I imagine, for now.

Mmmmh....I don´t know what to say.... I live in Mexico and it´s impossible to buy a copy of this game, so I baught one used in Ebay....and now you are telling me that there won´t be any support or activation?????

Not very nice!!!!

As I said, you can update to v1.0X but no further. If you want support and patches past v1.0X, we've made a discount available so that people can purchase a valid license.

Sorry to say that, but what cakruege said earlier is true. I don`t know about other countries, but here in Germany EULAs aren`t worth the paper they are written on. I can agree to whatever i like in an EULA and am not legally bound by it. So that means, if a game is published in Germany i can always resell it and whatever is said in an EULA is void. If you buy the CD here it means you buy the license, too. If that is also true for other countries as well, i don`t know...

See, you can honestly own a license to the game if you buy it used, regardless of the EULA. However, Stardock is in no way obligated to support you if you violate their EULA. You may have bought the license to the game, but support is sort of an extra.

See, thats the point...
Stardock has an obligation to provide you with patches which make the game relatively bug free.
I don`t recall which company it was, but they had to provide new serials and patches for used copies of the game. At least that is what court has decided. Alternative is refunds if the company doesn`t want to do this.

Apart from that, i really understand Stardocks point of view and think it is fair to offer the X patch for free and the rest not.

PS: I didn`t buy a used copy, so i don`t care anyway

PPS: Please make a multiplayer addon and keep up your excellent support!

See, thats the point... Stardock has an obligation to provide you with patches which make the game relatively bug free. I don`t recall which company it was, but they had to provide new serials and patches for used copies of the game. At least that is what court has decided. Alternative is refunds if the company doesn`t want to do this. Apart from that, i really understand Stardocks point of view and think it is fair to offer the X patch for free and the rest not. PS: I didn`t buy a used copy, so i don`t care anyway PPS: Please make a multiplayer addon and keep up your excellent support!

i would think that only if a company makes a OS or something that could be a easy enterance to a hacker/cracker would be REQUIRED to allow free updates (even MS does)

Now stardock does NOT have to update.. they could leave the game in 1.0 with all its problems

but they wont.. and i applaud them willing to help out.. yet you might have bought the "disk" for $20.00 but you don't own the game