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25Atan
25Atan
Join Date 11/2012
+1

Concerning the improvement of already trained units

November 19, 2012 8:27:23 AM from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Hello everyone,

 

So I've got this little idea in my head for a while now, and I think nobody created a specific thread for it, that concerns the troops that you can train.

 

Cooperation, Logistics and company, if I'm not mistaking let you increase the size of your regiments. In a similar manner, mounted warfare and the warg technology make you be able to train mounted troops.

 

Now what I would LOVE to be implemented is a way to upgrade the size of an already trained unit and to provide them with mounts if the appropriate technology is researched. These upgrades would of course cost money, just like armor/weapon upgrades.

 

This will allow to bring some of the earlier units that do well in combat into the late game, without having to disband them or leave them sleeping in a city that the AI will probably never attack anyway.

 

Thank you for your attention!

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25Atan
Lord Xia
Join Date 03/2006
+148
Reply #1 November 19, 2012 9:23:15 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Yea, this is something that has been asked for multiple times since WoM.  I do think it would be great if you could at least add troops to an old 3 man group you have leveled.  And the mounts too.  I hope it eventually does get implemented.

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25Atan
Wizaerd
Join Date 06/2006
+14
Reply #2 November 19, 2012 9:43:04 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

I completely agree with this, and sincerely hope it gets added.

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25Atan
SOLOSOL
Join Date 01/2012
+9
Reply #3 November 19, 2012 10:03:30 AM
from Stardock ForumsStardock Forums

100% agree.

I didn't think in disbanding old units, just got them sleeping, as you said.

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25Atan
Glazunov1
Join Date 08/2010
+26
Reply #4 November 19, 2012 10:43:32 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Agreed, as well.  It's a sensible feature, one that makes it easier for players to do something that on reflection should have been in from the first.

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25Atan
Takao21
Join Date 10/2007
+2
Reply #5 November 19, 2012 10:54:08 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

That would be awesome

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25Atan
Reigas
Join Date 11/2012
0
Reply #6 November 19, 2012 11:40:11 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

I agree as well. It would be nice to not have to effectively retire older units because you can't add to their numbers.

 

 

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25Atan
Borg999
Join Date 02/2006
+59
Reply #7 November 19, 2012 11:47:29 AM
from Stardock ForumsStardock Forums

I would like this too!

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25Atan
Mubunu
Join Date 06/2010
+1
Reply #8 November 19, 2012 12:23:56 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Would be wonderfull. For group increase in size, you could add an XP penalty proportionate to the number of guys added.

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Kongdej
Join Date 01/2012
+58
Reply #9 November 19, 2012 12:29:09 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Agreed

Sincerely
~ Kongdej

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25Atan
MontharKragan
Join Date 10/2012
0
Reply #10 November 19, 2012 10:30:14 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Yes this is most definitely needed.

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25Atan
andymate
Join Date 04/2009
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Reply #11 November 19, 2012 10:45:59 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Yep this would be a good feature. /signed

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25Atan
Ambermonk
Join Date 02/2004
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Reply #12 November 20, 2012 1:13:57 AM
from Stardock ForumsStardock Forums

I like this idea also.

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25Atan
Bobchillingworth
Join Date 03/2011
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Reply #13 November 20, 2012 1:43:51 AM
from Stardock ForumsStardock Forums

Yes, please.  

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25Atan
BabbyLuring
Join Date 10/2012
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Reply #14 November 20, 2012 1:58:11 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums


Sounds cool, sign me up

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25Atan
MarvinKosh
Join Date 08/2005
+87
Reply #15 November 20, 2012 3:13:48 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

I think that to keep it balanced it would have to knock off a number of levels to account for the newbie(s) in the unit, and keep the whole unit immobilised for the time it would take to train them.  At a Fortress these would be mitigated by the level and time modifiers for trained troops.

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25Atan
PocusFr
Join Date 04/2003
+2
Reply #16 November 20, 2012 4:05:56 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

You know that you can already increase the size of groups with an upgrade button, right? All you have to do is to check and edit likewise these lines:

        <!-- Unit grouping type upgrades -->
        <EnableUpgradeGroup>1</EnableUpgradeGroup>
        <UpgradeGoldCostPerTroop>25.0</UpgradeGoldCostPerTroop>

 

In elementaldefs.xml. Admittedly, this won't add horses, but at least you can enlarge your ... group.

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25Atan
seanw3
Join Date 12/2007
+141
Reply #17 November 20, 2012 4:17:01 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Been upgrading groups since Beta .81. 

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25Atan
Kongdej
Join Date 01/2012
+58
Reply #18 November 20, 2012 9:13:53 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting PocusFr,
reply 17
You know that you can already increase the size of groups with an upgrade button, right? All you have to do is to check and edit likewise these lines:

        <!-- Unit grouping type upgrades -->
        <EnableUpgradeGroup>1</EnableUpgradeGroup>
        <UpgradeGoldCostPerTroop>25.0</UpgradeGoldCostPerTroop>

In elementaldefs.xml. Admittedly, this won't add horses, but at least you can enlarge your ... group.

There is a difference between modding your game files, and just being able to do it in the vanilla game, What you say is the Developers have no issue implementing this, they just need to change a 0 into a 1...
They are either just too lazy, or doesn't care to explain why not to us who obviously think they're doing it wrong.

Sincerely
~ Kongdej

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25Atan
Humility
Join Date 09/2007
+7
Reply #19 November 20, 2012 9:52:23 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums


I agree that we should had this sort of upgrade, that's why I rare builded troop untill I max out reseached then build troop often...

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25Atan
Wizaerd
Join Date 06/2006
+14
Reply #20 November 20, 2012 10:00:04 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting PocusFr,
reply 17
You know that you can already increase the size of groups with an upgrade button, right? All you have to do is to check and edit likewise these lines:

        <!-- Unit grouping type upgrades -->
        <EnableUpgradeGroup>1</EnableUpgradeGroup>
        <UpgradeGoldCostPerTroop>25.0</UpgradeGoldCostPerTroop>

 

In elementaldefs.xml. Admittedly, this won't add horses, but at least you can enlarge your ... group.

If I were to make this change, where would this upgrade button be?  When would it be accessible and from where?  What other ramifications does this have,  what else would it affect and have dire consequences for?

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25Atan
25Atan
Join Date 11/2012
+1
Reply #21 November 20, 2012 10:45:59 AM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting PocusFr,
reply 17
You know that you can already increase the size of groups with an upgrade button, right? All you have to do is to check and edit likewise these lines:

        <!-- Unit grouping type upgrades -->
        <EnableUpgradeGroup>1</EnableUpgradeGroup>
        <UpgradeGoldCostPerTroop>25.0</UpgradeGoldCostPerTroop>

 

In elementaldefs.xml. Admittedly, this won't add horses, but at least you can enlarge your ... group.

 

Waow thanks Pocus! I'll have a look before my next game to make it available. This adress one of the issue, although as stated by Kongdej there is a difference between having access to this feature in vanilla and needing the lights and knowledge of people who know where to look/what to change to make it a reality.

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25Atan
Kalin
Join Date 03/2006
+29
Reply #22 November 20, 2012 4:40:59 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

It's very easy to do via a mod, but as I've been saying for quite some time, the upgrading system kills the AI, because they can't keep their units alive to make good use of the system. Meanwhile a decent player can keep those one or two units they made from the beginning of the game and keep upgrading it until they are level 30 and become completely indestructible. Heck, the whole group size system was probably made to make it so that this doesn't get out of hand (so that you'd have to replace your units).  If you make group size upgradable, you might as well remove the entire system. This is why, despite many people asking for it, it has never been implemented.

 

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25Atan
Humility
Join Date 09/2007
+7
Reply #23 November 20, 2012 4:58:29 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting Kalin,
reply 23
It's very easy to do via a mod, but as I've been saying for quite some time, the upgrading system kills the AI, because they can't keep their units alive to make good use of the system. Meanwhile a decent player can keep those one or two units they made from the beginning of the game and keep upgrading it until they are level 30 and become completely indestructible. Heck, the whole group size system was probably made to make it so that this doesn't get out of hand (so that you'd have to replace your units).  If you make group size upgradable, you might as well remove the entire system. This is why, despite many people asking for it, it has never been implemented.

 
I don't guess it, what any diffent when I don't build troop very much until I max out reseached tree then I build troop most of time so I dont' had to worry about disband troop when they are out of date and waste of time training them a xp?

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25Atan
Trojasmic
Join Date 04/2006
+40
Reply #24 November 20, 2012 5:04:22 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting seanw3,
reply 18
Been upgrading groups since Beta .81. 

You should release a mod with this as the only thing in it... call it the Upgrading Troop Size mod.  Brilliant.

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25Atan
Humility
Join Date 09/2007
+7
Reply #25 November 20, 2012 5:19:21 PM
from Elemental ForumsElemental Forums

Quoting Trojasmic,
reply 25



Quoting seanw3,
reply 18
Been upgrading groups since Beta .81. 


You should release a mod with this as the only thing in it... call it the Upgrading Troop Size mod.  Brilliant.
Yes, I was thinking about that but I guess he didn' do it because too many change during beta so he don't brother of making mod...

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