Hey y'all!

In a response to an earlier thread today (r.e. Warstaffs and the fact that they have been removed from 1.09p Sovereign creation apparently), I ended up sidetracking into a discussion of getting the 'Knowledge' trait for 10 points (1 tech per turn), versus spending those same 10 creation points on padded armor (2 defense), or spending 5 points on Wealthy (1 gildar per turn), and accumulating the 32 gildar for said padded armor instead, with 5 creation points spent elsewhere to boot.

In checking out the 1.09p creation window, I've noted a few things:

1) That currently only Men (and no other 'races') are allowed Traveling and Longstrider boots during Character Creation - what's up with that?

2) That in the midst of removing the Warstaff (good move IMHO), some changes were made to the weapons costs: Club now only takes 1 Character Point, and Staff now takes 2.

3) This is a long one:

It seems to me that the various costs for Armor need to be reduced, similar to the weapons above.  I'd suggest the rule of thumb of 1 CP per approximately 12 gildar in cost.  I'd also suggest that unused Character points be traded in for Gildar, at the 12 (or so) Gildar per CP rate (so if you trade in all 50 points, you'd get 600 extra gildar at start).

The armor purchase costs in the shop are currently in a state of flux (the Stardock guys are rebalancing things), hence my suggestion for the 'standard'. 

If you wanted to make it more fancy, the 'Tech Level' of said weapon could multiply the CP cost by some amount: i.e. Leather Cuirass shows up down the tech tree a bit, so it should cost more CP than the Gildar cost alone would suggest, to reflect the rarity of said item.

spending 36 Character points for 6 points of armor protection just seems waaaaay to expensive.  Especially if you instead go for the 'War Machine' trait for your custom race (using 2 of your 10 race points), which makes some armor available in the 'shop' for purchase.  I'm sure Derek and the guys have noticed this as well, and may address it eventually (not a priority at the moment, as they are on a bugslaying hunt).

I like the idea that your Sovereign finds some rare sword or suit of armor, or has it handed down as a family heirloom, as long as the CP cost isn't so high that you are really better off buying some trait instead.  Also, if said Sword or Armor were 'unique', i.e. not something you could research in one or two hops, that'd be cool!

Example: Your grandfather gives you the Chainmail Shirt that's been in the family for generations.  Or, a Longsword...

Both of the above items are a little down the tech tree (at least 30-40 turns down the road if you focused on weapons), not like staffs which are available 'right out of the gate'.  Also, while they will probably get traded in eventually, they will be useful to you for a good part of the early game.  A padded cuirass, on the other hand, becomes obsolete fairly quickly.

Another idea is to go the rings/amulet/cloak route for protection.  Soldier's/Traveler's Cloaks are generally something you use for the entire game, so getting one at the start will be a lot more useful than a padded cuirass.  Also, a ring/amulet of protection +1, speed +1, or move +1 is another item you'll likely keep using for a long time.

The jist here is that Character Points you spend on equipment should have a lasting value, similar to the various other traits you may choose during creation.  Staffs and padded armor will be replaced fairly quickly ingame.  A ring may be with you the entire game, similar to the 'bonus' attributes.  Wealthy is +1 gildar every turn for the many (300+)  turns of your game.

Also, it'd be nice if the 'starting items' could be passed down.  So that chain shirt I just mentioned, if you could give that to Janusk when you find the Armor of Azor, that'd make it a little more useful.  And if that chain shirt was unique, such as it provided 1 more protection than your run of the mill chain shirt...

I'm not suggesting that something UBER should be available right off.  6 Defense in the early game, or a weapon with a 6-9 attack, is probably about the most a Sovereign should start with.  And the 9 attack spear is debatable - wolves, bandits, and swarm spiders die quickly against guys using said spear.  A Sovereign or Hero with a 6 Def AND a 9 Attack on the warpath will dominate most combats the first few turns.

What I am suggesting is that the mentioned 6 Defense should be from one or two items (Breastplate, Cloak), not a bunch of 1 point armor sections that you'll be tossing at the first opportunity.  And, as I stated before, not cost 36 CP...

Plus, cloaks, amulets and rings don't mess up the custom outfit you spent a few minutes on during creation,  for those who like to look fashionable out in the wastelands!

Now, if you could pick your outfit, then assign a defense value to one piece of it - say, +4 defensive magic is weaved into to the vest you've chosen, then you wouldn't have to be caught dead in padded leather... That might get a little too complex though (rings are easier).

I'd suggest the 'books' you find on the road (Defense of Fools, etc.), but that's just another way to modify attack and defense directly, which incidentally were removed from character creation (now you can only modify Str and Dex).

4) As for the CP value of the various point generation traits (Wealthy, Attunement, etc.), these seem OK to me (i.e. not too unreasonable). Specifics:

10 CP for the +1 to tech every turn doesn't seem excessive to me. 

10 CP for +1 to Arcane every turn, seems about right, although spell research seems a little slow currently.  25 turns for a level 1 spell at said +1 per turn.  Really?

5 CP for +1 go Gildar every turn also seems about right. 

5 CP for +2 Mana per turn, hmmm dunno yet.

5 CP for +2 Food per turn.  Probably a bargain but 10 seems excessive.  Plus, once food production kicks into high gear, this isn't as big of a deal.

That'll do for now, to get this discussion rolling.