Right because men and women like exactly the same thing in the rest of their lives right... or wait, no, no we don't do we? See you're making the same mistake most the industry does, you're making assumptions instead of... just asking. It is no secret that the bulk of the gaming industry caters to young white males. If other people like their games, its pure accident, not intentional.

Women gamers in general just want to be catered to like everyone else. Whether that means to continue to pump out Pogo games for my aunt, she loves those, throw out mario games for my lil sisters, (she's not a child), or make me a new x-com game, the fact is most dedvelopers and publishers never pay attention either way. It is no surprise to me that the Sims series reportedly has an unusually larger number of women on their development teams, and what do you know, women, in large numbers, really like that series. Of course when you are dealing with an abysmal 12% working in the industry, a large number could be 1 or 2 instead of zero for all I know.

I don't know what opposite means either because no one said it was opposite except for you. I have seen developers do that though, decide that selling for women means selling "pink" games to girls which are typically crappily made and sell like garbage. That's just some pencil pusher guessing instead of actually doing the leg work and figuring out what that part of the market wants.

Personally I can't say much about elemental. I am interested in it, but I don't do pre-orders so am not part of the beta process. Judging from the 4% of women on these forums, my guess is there aren't many women in the beta process either. I could be wrong of course.

Oh right, so you’re saying you like shit games then? what I was alleging was that good games are good games, regardless of who they’re supposedly catering to. If women don’t like shooters or strategy titles or racing games or RPGs, what games do they like then? And if they DO like such games, exactly how would you advise catering to the female gamer in such titles?

Like I said, good games are good games. They don’t need to be “catered” to anyone in terms of sex, race or class.

You’re just proving my point…Women gamers are no different to men; they enjoy games based on personal preference, not some weird biological determinism. First you would have to identify the fundamental differences between the gaming sexes before you argue that developers should pay attention or treat gamers as two distinct groups based on gender.

now i know why stardock is FrogBoys happy place haha

Well asking is a good start. Marketing isn't just about making stuff up and seeing what sticks. There are actually methods available to study and inquire about your target market. I never said women don't like the same games men did. What I have been saying is we aren't catered to, for the most part, so that if we like a game, it's just by chance. You don't make a character like Bayonetta has and tell me she was created for women because she is a female character. Clearly she wasnt' created to appeal to women, although that doesn't mean some women won't like her.

Having women on the team, also helps. Encouranging women into the field is also a plus and these days it is less of an issue but when I was younger, it was just starting to be "okay" for girls to play games. I played games as a girl and pretty much got stuck with the agile weak but faster character that was known as the cliche female character in a lot of games, and there was usually just one of them too. If my sister played with me, i picked some other guy. There is always a chance I would prefer to play a male character anyway, but having the choice is important too.

I personally think RPGs have done a pretty good job in attracting women to the games, but there are issues. I think simply asking, why do the female characters have fewer options, fewer quests, and often less interesting romance choices is an important question that shoudl be addressed. If we have a game where the "character" is only an avatar (as in it doesn't really matter who you pick" why are we being so lazy as to not link the pronouns to acknowledge the character is female and not male.  Tropico 3, Space Rangers 2, and Patrician III (pretty sure it was III) all do this... they throw in this hey, maybe we should do female avatars in case someone wants to play them but we won't bother to change the text to reflect that choice and therefore really couldn't give a damn to do it right.

I've been playing game for a couple of decades now. I know when when you go to a industry event, most of them don't even bother to pack their t-shirts in women sizes. Booth babes are not there to sell games to women, gamers or in the industry, and everytime a platform or game does incredibly well the the women population, guys come out of the woodwork to dismiss it and make it a big joke... tryint to protect "their" territory.

Even when I am a playing a "good" game, which is a completely subjective term by the way, I am painfully aware when a developer put in zero, zip, natta attempt to appeal to women gamers.

well, I would argue that this is a difference between casual and hardcore gamers, rather than gender. Women may constitute a larger % of casual gamers, but in the days of PSPs DSs & Wiis I would hardly call them a maligned section of the gaming consumer base.

no, what im arguing is that games are developed to be fun and good, and that one's gender or race (i mean seriously, minorities? lol) has less of a determining factor in the types of games that are enjoyed by people than you seem to think.

plus, you didnt answer my question. exactly how would a game catering to girls differ from what we're seeing today? and i don't mean the boring casual games, im talking about real titles. how would a company tailor say, a racing game towards girls? what would be the differences? show me the united women's front and i'll show you a bunch of gamers whose tastes are as different and diverswe as their male counterparts.

yeah, because i am so thrilled to death by the plethora of dumbed-down titles we've being shovelled recently. the difference is i don't expect developers to tailor their games to my needs because i identify with a particular group.

Okay, let's say I make a FPS.  How should I make it marketable to female gamers?

Selling games by digital download is a growing market, and as it is still in its early stages, the growth rate is impressive, and I am impressed by Impulses rapid development into the market. I feel that the market will later on become flooded with different types of digital distrubutions, but it will become so flooded with so many new companies willing to enter the digital distrubution market, that only the big competitors will stay in buiness (Steam, Impulse etc.)

I have steam, and impulse, and I love impulse more, its more fluid, easier to use, and of course, smooth and problem free for me, where as steam is the complete oppsite to impulse.

Problem is, I dont ever see impulse taking over Steam, becuase steam just has more vairety of games, and more games in general. Maybe impulse will carry on growing and growing, 205% or more, is very impressive indeed. But Impulse needs more games (which it will get), but most importantly something new, and exciting which can attract new consumers to the company, (something different from games).

Just Finshed reading about GDP for My Macroeconomics lecture , just applying some methods.

Call it Portal 2?

I know, not an FPS - I was jokeing. Mostly.

My Girlfriend plays games like Animal Crossing and such, but her favorites are actually Halo series, run and gun shooters like Serious Sam and the like. It all depends on the individual. There is no set demographic IMO, different people like different games. If you want to feel slighted as a gamer and blame it on the industry being male dominated, that's a personal issue. There is enough variety in games being offered nowadays that anyone who calls themselves a gamer should be able to find something that satisfies their itch.

Back to Steam though, i still prefer Impulse, and Steams 3 hour downtime tonight only solidfies that. Everything is so incestial with them that when something need to be taken down, they pretty much take it all down. I hate that.

And why you think women are a larger % of casual gamers? Maybe because most games that are done aren't appealing to them? Sex and age are a big deal when creating a game, and if women play far less games than men it's because they like different things. Same with old people. That's why you create specific games for those targets (hello Brain Training games) while if you want to target the young male demography you do Call of Duty.

Maybe we could talk about the original topic? (Read: Not female vs male game appeal)