Yes, we do need to teach our kids what is important to us. I've never understood the whole, "I won't teach my kids any religion, when they get old enough they'll make up their own minds". To me, the lesson the kids get from that is, the parents don't think religious beliefs are important. We wouldn't say, "I won't teach my kids personal hygiene, when they get old enough, they'll make up their own minds".

The problem today is, the schools want to teach kids that what their parents do is wrong. That isn't the job of the schools and no parent should put up with it.

Of course Ock, I see your point.  We have to brainwash...err...teach our kids all about our values and ways of seeing the world.  I mean, if they don't turn into little versions of us with all our viewpoints and outlooks on life, then I think as parents, we have failed.

These kids don't need to decide for themselves, that's too hard.  We've spent time deciding things, I think the nicest thing we could do is instill in them everything we think we know.

I mean, we've got all the answers, and they got us this far...why give them the chance to follow their own way? They might screw up and learn something new.  *psh*  I'll have none of that.

~Zoo

Depends on how and what you teach.

There's a difference between actual teaching and...well...brainwashing.

If a teacher is good and fair, then the child learns to think. If the teacher is bad or let's say has an agenda to push, then the child does not think, but merely parrots what it has been told.

~Zoo

Ok, to be honest...I'm not being fair here.  There's a hidden message.  Literally hidden.  Can you find it?

There's a hint in the first response which is mine.  (Which is why I placed it there)

Ah Ock, then I see you are one of those who don't care what your kids are brought up with, as long as you don't have to teach it to them.

If you don't teach your kids what matters to you, all you have taught them is that nothing matters to you.


Kids will grow up and decide for themselves what they want, teaching your kids doesn't change that. If fact, no matter what you "tell" your kids, your actions will teach them anyway. If you teach your kids to go to church by dropping them off every week, you have taught them that church is only for kids. If you tell your kids that doing homework is important, but never help them when they need it, you are teaching them that homework really doesn't matter.

It is not only the right of every parent to pass their beliefs about life on to their kids, it is the parents' responsibility... and yes, that means atheism too.

I think one of the reason so many kids today don't respect anyone but themselves is they are being raised by parents who teach them exactly that.


~~~

I will add though, the "Fear" aspect of your article did seem awful heavy handed.

I saw the hidden message before I posted.

Ock, how long are your kids going to do harm before they think for themselves that they should do no harm?

Teaching is fine. If you sit the kid down and say, this is what I view as right and wrong, this is my philosophy, this is my religion. Do you have any questions? Would you like me to teach you about these things? Or maybe a more informal environment when you're walking around with your kid and you decide to share some of your wisdom. That's not a bad thing.

Also, teaching your kids the basics...speech, how to walk, how to tie their shoes, etc. It's all good stuff.


The problem I see Ock having is telling kids what to believe without giving any support or letting them have any reasoning to it.

Let's take racism for example.
"Blacks are bad people."
"Why?"
"They're just bad people."

Rinse and repeat with variations and not so wholesome language and you succeed in turning an innocent child into a racist. Kids tend to trust the adults that they're around...so whatever they say often becomes law...at least when they're really young. While teaching them right and wrong is cool and all, but pushing other junk into their heads that doesn't make sense to them when they're that young is basically training them to become tiny versions of you, not their own person. That could mess up a kid later in life when they have to confront the world and make their own choices and decisions. At that point it's not what Mommy or Daddy thinks is right, it's what I think is right...and if they've never been allowed to figure things out for themselves...well, then you've got yourself a problem.


Or at least I think that's what Ock was getting at.

~Zoo

Well, crap...now I can't see.

~Zoo

Nice, Ock. My parents taught me to think, too. It's the best way.

I suppose that depends on a person's personal definition of what "doing harm" is.  My children aren't doing any harm at all, to my knowledge.  See...I've only ever taught them one thing.  To think things out, and I've told them I support whatever conclusions they come to.  But they must be able to "show their work" (if you remember the familiar quote from math class).  Note:  I don't say they must show work which comes to a conclusion I have.

Here's an example so we don't go into a digression that isn't worthy of discussion.

My son, for quite some time, wanted to be a pilot.  Unfortunately, my son is also color blind, and this of course, would keep him out of any piloting program (be it air force or commercial or whatever.)  I talked ot him about this about a year ago, and he laughed and said "Yeah, but Dad, you can memorize the color blind test and pass it."

I let it go...for the moment.

Several people in my life said I should stop him.  I could not stand idly by while he cheated on a test which might endanger lives.  Well, of course I couldn't, and had if he had cheated on this test and passed it, I would have blown the whistle on him.  I do not wish to indoctrinate my children, but it would be a wrong of ME to allow him to do that because my enabling would have endangered lives.

So I waited...because I wanted him to come to this realization on his own.  I encouraged him to think.  He thought, and a couple of months ago came to the conclusion, on his own, that it would be a wrong thing to do.  This is exactly what I expected.  My son is a good young man, soon to be a good adult man.  I'm very proud of him.

Teaching right from wrong is not the same thing as indoctrination.  Part of the makeup of human beings is that they are helpless at young ages, and it is a matter of survival that they believe what they are told by their elders.  If they don't, they will come to more harm (potentially death) and sooner.  But many people abuse this.  The dust from the disintigrated bones lies scattered across New York City of two pilots who were indoctrinated to believe what they were told was true.  For them, Jythier, their truth was every bit as real as your own.

When it comes to any belief system, be it religion, politics, or whatever, it is a worthy question to ask "Would my child believe this if I hadn't taught it to them?"

If I ask any of you your religion or political affiliation and then disagree with it from any standpoint whatsoever, you will ultimately be forced to say "Well, Ock, it's my life and my decision.  You believe whatever you want.  I believe this."  Would you not?

But that doesn't apply to children, huh?  We gotta stack the deck on them and make sure they grow up good republicans, or good liberals, or good jews, or good catholics because WE have decided for OURSELVES that this is the right way to think.  Statistically speaking, some of you did come to your beliefs on your own, and some of you believe what you believe because you were taught to believe it at a young age.  There is a reason that there isn't a large number of "conversions" between political lines, and there is definitely a reason why you don't see lots of Islamic jihadists suddenly turning to Christianity (and vice versa).  The reason is indoctrination.

I must wonder how many people would believe what they believe had they not been indoctrinated themselves.  I wonder what the opinion of the people in the World Trade center would be on the subject...provided they were still around to have an opinion.

Gangs are full of kids whose parents didn't teach them what to believe in, so the kids found someone who would.

AsaxyGirl:

My point is that it is important to teach them both. In fact, from about 15 or 16, the only thing a parent can really teach their kids is how to think for themselves. At that point, anything else the parent hopes to teach their kids has already been accepted or rejected by the kids.

At least that is how I see it.